DEBATE WITH A MINISTER

　HUNDREDS of Methodist ministers, old and young, were gathered at their annual conference at the Central Hall, Westminster.   They had been discussing every aspect of their teaching, and work, for nearly two weeks.

　Now and then, though only in conversation, “Spiritualism" had cropped up. One Methodist minister, who called on Hannen Swaffer, asked how he could go to a séance. He had read Doyle's book, The New Revelation, but, otherwise, he knew little.

　"You can come to my home circle tomorrow night," said Swaffer. "During the sitting, Silver Birch, one of the guides, will control a trance medium. You can ask him any question you like, argue, contradict, differーsay anything you please. But do not go away afterwards and complain that something was not explained to you. You can ask anything. We will print the story, but omit your name. Then you will not get into a row, unless you want to."

　The parson, a charming, most intelligent young man　obviously imbued with the love of service, went to the séance. In due course, Silver Birch came through.

　"May the inspiration of the Great White Spirit dwell among you all," he began, “and may you all respond to all that He would have you do, so that each one of you may feel you are a part of the Great White Spirit. Take that part with you wherever you go, and show it to all the children of the Great White Spirit.''

　Then, addressing the parson, he explained: “My medium is filled with the power of what you call the Holy Spirit.' That makes him 'speak in tongues.'... I am one of those who have already been 'resurrected.'”

　"What do you think of the other world?" asked the clergy-man, beginning his search for knowledge of spirit teaching. 

　"It is very much like your world," was the reply, "except that our world is a world of effects, and yours is a world of causes."

　"Did you have any fear when you left this world?”

　"No. All we Red Indians were psychic, and we under-stood it was nothing to be afraid of. We were psychic like the man who founded your religionーWesley. He was moved by the power of the spirit. You know that?"

　"Yes," said the minister.

　"But they do not move by the power of the spirit' now, went on the guide. "There are many links in the chain which leads to the Great White Spirit, and the lowest ones in your world are linked to the highest angels, as you call them, in the world of spirit. No one in your world is so bad that he is not in touch with the Great White Spirit, Whom you call God.''

　"Do you know one another on the Other Side?" asked the Methodist.

　"How do you know them in your world?" was the reply.

　With my eyes," said the parson; "I see with them.”

　"But you do not see with your physical eyes," persisted the guide. "You see with the spirit.'

　"Yes," admitted the minister. "I see with my mentality, which, I suppose, is part of the spirit.”

　"I see with my spirit, too,” explained the guide. "I see your spirit, and I also see your physical body. But that is only a shadow. The light is the spirit.”

　"What is the greatest sin people commit on earth?" asked the Methodist.

　"There are many, many sins," was the answer; "but the greatest sin of all is the sin against the Great Spirit.”

　"Tell him what that means," interposed a sitter.

　"It is those who know, and deny the Great Spirit,” ex-plained the spirit. "That is the biggest sin of all.”

　"That is what they call 'the sin against the Holy Ghost,'” said one of the circle.

　"They call it 'the sin against the Holy Ghost' in the big book," replied the guide; "but it is really the sin against the spirit."

　"What do you think of the Revised Version?" asked the parson. "Which is better, the Revised or the Authorized?"

　"The words do not matter," said the guide. "It is what you do, my son, that counts. The truth of the Great White Spirit is found in many books, and also in the hearts of those who try to serve Him, wherever they are, and whoever they might be. That is the greatest Bible of all."

　"Suppose they do not get converted before they die?" asked the clergyman. "What happens then?"

　"I do not understand what you mean by 'converted,'" said Silver Birch. "Put it more plainly."

　"Suppose a man lives a wicked life, and passes on," said the minister. "Another man makes a mental resolve to do right. What will the difference between the two men be in the other realm?"

　"I will tell you from your own book," said the spirit. "That which a man sows, that shall he reap! You cannot change that. You bring into our world what you areーnot what you think you are, and not what you try to show other people you are. It is what you are inside. You will be able to see it for yourself when you come here."

　"He dreams dreams," said the guide, meaning the parson, to Swaffer.

　"Do you mean he is psychic?" asked Swaffer.

　"Yes," was the answer. "Why did you bring him here?”

　"Oh! he called on me," said Swaffer.

　"He is being led step by step," said the guide, "and the light must be shown gradually."

　To the parson, the guide added: "Are you surprised that an old Indian knows so much about your Bible?"

　"You seem to know a lot about it," said the Methodist.

　"He has been dead three thousand years," said one of the circle.

　"Did you know David?" asked the parson, making a quick sum in his head. David lived about B.C. 1000.

　"I am not a white man," said the guide. "I am a Red Indian. I lived in the mountains of the North-West of America. I am what you call a savage. But I have seen in your western world more savagery and cruelty and ignorance than ever I saw among the humble Indians three thousand years ago. All the cruelty that the white people practise, even today, on those who are economically worse than themselves, is one of the greatest sins against the Great White Spirit."

　"How do you find the people on the Other Side?" asked the parson. "Do they feel remorse acutely?"

　"What men are most sorry for is that which they have left undone,” explained the spirit. "When you come into our world, you will see for yourself. You will see everything you have done and everything you have not done which you ought to have done. You will look at those neglected opportunities, and that will cause your remorse.''

　"What do you say about faith in Christ?" asked the minis-ter. "Is that something which satisfies God? If you have faith in him you try to follow his example."

　"Not those who say 'Lord, Lord,' " quoted the guide, “but those who do the works of my Father. That is all that mattersーnot what you say or believe, nor even what you think, but w hot you do. If you have no faith at all, and you help to uplift the fallen, to give bread to the hungry, and light to those who grope in darkness, then you are doing the work of the spirit."

　One of the sitters asked whether Jesus was part of the God-head.

　"The Nazarene was a great master, who came into your world,” explained the Indian spirit. "They did not listen to his teaching. They crucified him. They are still crucifying him. There is a part of the Great White Spirit in everybody, but in some more of the Great Spirit shows than in others."

　"Christ is universally admitted as being the best man who ever lived," said the parson. "Such a man could not lie. He said: 'I and my Father are one. He that hath seen me hath seen the Father.' Did not that indicate that he was God?"

　"You must read the Bible again," came the reply.   "He said: 'My Father is greater than I,' didn't he?"

　"Yes," admitted the parson.

　"Didn't he also teach you to pray and say 'Our Father which art in Heaven'? He did not teach you to pray to him. If he taught people to pray to his father, how could he be his 'Father which art in Heaven'? He did not say: 'Pray to me,' but he said: 'Pray to our Father.'”

　"He spoke of your God and my God,' " said the clergy-man. "He never spoke of 'our God.' He never put himself on a level with other men."

　"He never said 'your God and I,' " persisted the guide.  "He said: 'Greater things shall ye do than I do.' You must understand that, when you read your book, you must not try and make the words fit. You must read them with the under-standing of the spirit, for the spirit is the key which unlocks all the mysteries. That is why the Nazarene spoke in parables.”

　Then the parson quoted the words: "God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son," in support of his contention that the Nazarene was part of the Godhead.

　"The Nazarene never said that,” said the guide. "It was put into the Bible many, many years after at what you call the Council of Nicea."

　"The Council of Nicea?" asked the parson.

　"It was in the year 325," answered the spirit, very quickly.

　"Those words that I quoted," said the parson, “were in the Gospel of St. John, which was circulated before then."

　"How do you know?" asked the guide.

　"Oh, history tells us," replied the parson.

　"Which history?" persisted Silver Birch.

　"I cannot quite tell,” said the visitor.

　"How do you know?" asked the spirit again. "Where are the books from which your Bible was written?"

　"John's Gospel was a finished piece of work," said the Methodist.

　"No, I mean before then," replied the guide.

　"It was finished by about the year 90," said the visitor.

　"Where are the originals from which your Bible was compiled?" demanded the spirit.

　"There are various documents," said the minister, naming one of them.

　"They are copies," said the guide. "Where are the originals?"

　The parson could not answer this, so the spirit guide answered it for him.

　"The originals of your book," he said, “are locked up in what you call the Vatican, and they have not been shown to your world. That which you call the Bible is only a copy of a copy of a copy, and in these copies there are many things which are not in the originals. The early Christians expected the Nazarene to come back on his second visit very quickly, so no one wrote down the details of his life on earth. Later on, they lost their hope and their faith, and they started writing down from memory all they could remember. When you say: 'The Nazarene said'ーyou do not know he said these things."

　"Is it not a fact," asked the Methodist, "that there is evidence in the four Gospels of a basic Gospel, which we know as 'Q'? The main facts are in all the Gospels."

　"I do not say these things did not happen," said the guide. "I only say that you cannot say every word in your Bible is what the Nazarene said. You must understand that many things in the Bible came from books which existed a long time before the Nazarene came into your world.”

　"What do you think about the book which is being written on the unwritten sayings of Christ?" asked the minister.

　"It is not his sayings that the Nazarene wants," persisted the spirit. "He wants all the people in your world to try and do the works of the Father. They worry too much about sayings, and not enough about doings. Where you preach what you call the Gospel, you have a congregation hungering for the truth of the Great White Spirit. It is not what the Nazarene said that counts: it is what you can show in your own life as an example.

　"Your world will not be saved by sayings. It will not be Saved by long, long words. It will only be saved when the children of the Great White Spirit are ready to gird on the armour of the Great White Spirit and fight the forces of darkness and oppression, all that which holds man in bondage. That is more important than the unwritten sayings of the Nazarene."

　"Why do we get so much pain in this world?" asked the parson.

　"It is only through pain that you learn the truth of the Great White Spirit," was the reply. "Out of the crucible of bitter experience you understand the truth of the laws which govern your world."

　"Many people seem to have no pain," said the visitor.

　"You are a man of God," replied the guide, “and you must learn to understand that it is the things of the spirit that count, and not the things of the body. The pain of the spirit is greater than the pain of the body."

　"The present system does seem unfair,” said one of the circle.

　"One day," was Silver Birch's reply, "everything that happens in your life will be adjusted. One day you will hold in your own hands a pair of scales and adjust the balance yourselves. You cannot escape the natural law that you reap what you sow in this world. You think some get off lightly. But they do not. You cannot see inside their souls.

　"The Law of the Great White Spirit is the only law that I recognize. I do not recognize the laws of man. The laws of man have to be altered, and changed, but never the laws of the Great White Spirit. Unless your world is suffering, you are not able to call attention to all the things that you must put right. All the pain and the suffering and the evil are there because you, who are parts of the Great White Spirit, must learn how to overcome them.

　"Unless you do these things, you are not doing the works of the Father, Who sent you here. Who are you to judge the Great White Spirit, Whose laws have governed all the world from the beginning, and will go on to the end?"

　"What do you do in your world?" was the next question.

　"What do you do in this world;" countered the guide.

　"Oh, I read a lot," said the Methodist, “and I preach a good deal."

　"I read a lot, too," was the guide's answer, "and I am preaching a very big sermon now.”

　"I have to travel all over the country," said the parson.

　"And I have to travel all over the world of spirit,” said the guide. "I have to journey down to the dark places where there are people whom your world has sent over here before they are ready. That takes up a lot of my time. I want you to understand that you hold a very great position. Some who call themselves men of God do not fulfil their true function. They merely stand up and speak a lot of words which do not mean anything.

　"But if you will put yourself in the hands of the Great White Spirit and open your soul to receive that inspiration which comes from the Great White Spirit's reservoir, you can be filled with that power which inspired the prophets of old. Through your work there can come in your corner of the world a light whose illumination will shed brightness into the hearts of many who are downcast and weary."

　"I think that is delightful,” said the clergyman.

　"No," said the guide. "It is not delightful; it is true. I meet a lot of clergymen here who realize their remorse. They look back and see where they have failed to teach the message of the spirit, where they have concerned themselves about books, words, and sayings, and not enough about doings. They want to come back if they can. I show them how to inspire men like you, so that, through you and others, a new truth of the Great White Spirit may be borne once more in the world.

　"You must understand that you live in a world which is falling to pieces, and that you are witnessing the beginning of a new orderーa time when the Kingdom of Heaven shall come on earth. It will be accompanied by much pain and suffering and tears, but in the end the Great White Spirit will return to your midst. Each one of you can help to bring the new world into being, for you parts of the Great White Spirit, and can help to do His work."

　Before the spirit went, at the end of this first séance, he said to the visitor: "I will go with you church where you preach. When you preach a very, very good sermon, you will know that it is the spirit.”

　"I have been praying that I shall have great power,” said the parson.

　"All your prayers will be answered," was the guide's answer.

　　　　★      ★      ★      ★      ★

　"Is it possible for people on earth to live perfect lives, to be sanctified and made holy?" was the minister's first question at the second séance. "Is it possible for us to love everybody?"

　"No, it is not possible, but you can try,” said Silver Birch. "All the efforts you make are very important in the building of your character. If you never were angry, never bitter, and never lost your temper, you would cease to be human. The Law is that you are put here to develop your spirit, so that it can grow and grow. It never stops growing in your world or in mine."

　"What did Jesus mean when he said: 'Be ye perfect even as your Father which is in Heaven is perfect'?"

　"He meant you must try to be perfect," replied the guide. "That is the ideal you should try to express in your lifeーto express the Great White Spirit that is in you."

　"The passage I quoted occurs in the last verse of the sth chapter of St. Matthew,” explained the visitor. "It comes after Christ was speaking about universal love, and he said that 'certain people love their neighbours and some people love their friends, but be ye therefore perfect, ye are the children of God.' The idea is that God loves everybody, and we should love everybody. Do you think that Christ would have given us a command which we could not carry out?"

　"You want to make all the world like the Nazarene!” exclaimed Silver Birch. "Do you think that he lived a per-fect life in your world?"

　"Yes, I think he lived a perfect life.”

　"Do you think he was never angry?"

　"I think he was disgusted with certain things that went on."

　"Do you think he was never angry?" persisted the guide.

　"I think he was never angry in the sense that it is wrong to be angry."

　"That is not the question I asked you. I asked you whether he was ever angry; not could you justify it, because you can always justify anything."

　One of the sitters recalled the incident when Jesus turned the money-changers out of the temple.

　"That is what I meant,” said the spirit. “You must not try to read into the life of the Nazarene something that did not happen. He was very angry when he saw people in your world desecrate the temple of the Great White Spirit, and he took whips to whip them out. That was anger. I do say it was not justified, but it was anger, and anger is a human passion.

　"I only tell you that to show you that he had some human qualities. When you try to follow the example of the Nazarene, you must understand that he was a human being in whom there was a great manifestation of the Great White Spirit—a greater manifestation in his case than there has been in other cases. Is that clear?"

　"Yes."

　"I am only trying to help you. You must not think that the way to please the Nazarene is to put him on a very high pedestal where nobody else can reach him. You please him only when you make him like you and like every other man in the physical world. He does not want to be above. He wants to be with them. He wants to be an example, so that everyone else can do the things he did. If you put him so high that no one in your world can follow him, then all his life is in vain."

　"Do you think we have free willz?" asked the minister, changing the subject.

　"Yes. Free will is the law."

　"Don't you think that sometimes a man is made to do things under impulses over which he has no control? Is he impelled to do things, or has he free will?"

　"What do you think?" queried the guide.

　"I think we are free agents,” said the minister.

　"You are all given free will," Silver Birch explained, "ex-cept that you must live all your lives within the Law of the Great White Spirit. The laws which are laid down by His love, for the use of all His children, are there, and you cannot change them. Within all these limits you are free."

　"If we are free, then sin is a terrible thing,” declared the visitor. "If a man sins wilfully, it seems more terrible than if he were impelled to do it.”

　"I can only tell you this: Whatever wrong is done in your world, the one who does that wrong must put it right. If he does not put it right in your world, then he must put it right from our world."

　"Do you think that some people have very strong heredi-tary tendencies in things that are not ideal?" asked the Methodist. "It is easier for some people to be good than others."

　"That is a very hard question," confessed the spirit, "be-cause each one of you has free will. When you do that which is not right, inside your heart you know it is not right. Whether you resist it or not depends on the character which you have grown for yourself. The sin is bad or worse only according to the harm that it does.”

　This immediately brought the question: "Doesn't that cut across the idea that sin is an intellectual thing? If sin is only bad in relation to its consequences, then sins of thought do not count at all."

　"All sin is sin," was the reply. "Whether you sin with the body or the mind or the spirit, it is all sin. You asked just now whether man acts on impulse. Where does the impulse come from?"

　"From thought."

　"Where do the thoughts come from?" asked Silver Birch The minister hesitated and said: "The good thoughts com from God."

　"Where do the bad ones come from?" persisted the spirit.

　"I don't know.”

　"The Great White Spirit is in everything," declared Silver Birch, "in that which is wrong and in that which is right. He is in the sun and in the storm; in everything that is beauti-ful and everything that is ugly. He is in the sky and the ocean, the thunder and the lightning; not only in beauty and goodness, but in sin and ugliness. Do not you understand; you cannot limit the Great White Spirit? The whole world is His creation, and His spirit is everywhere.

　"You cannot cut off anything and say that does not belong to the Great White Spirit. You must not say that the sunshine comes from the Great White Spirit and the rain, which destroys the crops, comes from the devil. The Great White Spirit is in everything. You are like an instrument which can receive thoughts and send out thoughts, but the thoughts that you receive depend upon your character and your spirit. If you live what you call a perfect life, then you can only receive the perfect thoughts. But because you are human, you receive all kinds of thoughtsーjust those thoughts which and your soul and your mind are capable of receiving. Is that clear to you?"

　"Yes, I think so," was the minister's comment. “Suppose anyone gets on in life and funds that he has received and followed the bad and neglected the good. He is about to pass over and his life is worrying him. What is your opinion of the peace which people profess to experience when they accept the words, 'By faith are ye saved? What do you think about the doctrine of conversion?"

　Without hesitation the spirit replica: "I quote words from your book, which I think you know: 'What shall it profit a man if he shall gain the whole world and lose his own soul？Then there are some more words which say: 'Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and all these things shall be added unto you.' You know those words well, but do you understand them? Do you rcalize that they are real, they happen, they are the Law? You know those words which say: "Whatsoever a man soweth, he shall reap.'

　"How can you chcat the Law of the Great White Spirit? Do you think a man who all his physical life has neglected his opportunities to help his fellow-beings, can, on his death-bed, be converted and his spirit alter in one second? Do you think he can blot out all the things which he should have done, which register themselves on his spirit body?

　"Do you think that in the sight of the Great White Spirit a man who has neglected his own spirit is on an equal basis with the man who strives all his physical life to work for the Great White Spirit and for His children? Do you think the Law of the Great White Spirit can be just if, because a man sorry, he could wipe out all his sins? Do you think so?"

　To this the minister said: "I think that God, in Christ, has provided an escape. Jesus said───"

　But Silver Birch interrupted: "My son, I asked you a very straight question. I want a very straight answer. I do not want you to tell me what it says in a book, because I know what it says there. What do you think?"

　"It does not seem fair, but it is just there that the greatness of God's love comes in," said the cleric.

　"If you walk down this road, you come to a big building where they administer the laws of man,” declared the guide. "If the law were administered as I have just explained it, that a man who sins all his life and the man who tries to do good all his life are equal in the eyes of the law of man, would you say that the laws of man were just?"

　"I do not say that the man who has walked in the straight road all his life," the minister replied, “and has loved every-body, and has acted in an upright way, and trusted in Christ all his life, I do not say──"

　Again the spirit interrupted: "He sows, and what he sows, he reaps. You cannot escape the Law. You cannot cheat the Law."

　"But what message have I got for a dying man if I have to tell him he has made a mess of things and must make up for it?" the parson asked.

　"Tell him this from me," Silver Birch answered. 'If he is a real man, in whom there is something of the Great White Spirit, then he, as a man, will want to put right all the things which he put wrong. If he wants to escape from the conse-quences of all his own actions, then I say he is not a man; he is only a coward." 

　"When a man confesses his sins, don't you think he is doing a thing that not everyone has the courage to do?" was the next question.

　"It is only a step in the right direction,” said Silver Birch. "But the confession does not wipe out the sin. He had free will, and he chose to do wrong instead of doing right. He cannot escape the consequences. He must put it right. He only cheats himself by thinking he can say a magic formula to gain escape. He must reap what he has sown; that is the Law."

　The minister persisted: “But Jesus said: ‘Come unto me... and I will give you rest'."

　The spirit asked the minister if he knew these words:  "The letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.'” Then he added: "You cannot take all the words and say that you must accept their literal meaning, because if you do, there are many things in that book which you do not do today. You know that."

　Once again the parson quoted: "Jesus said: 'The good shepherd giveth his life' for the sheep.' I always preach the doctrine of forgiveness, implying that if a person accepts the forgiveness that Christ offers, and at the same time he tacitly admits that the whole law of Christ governs his life, his life is then one great offering of love."

　Then Silver Birch forced home this lesson: "The Great Spirit has implanted in you some of His own reason. I plead with you to use that reason. If you do anyone a big wrong, and you confess it, that confession helps your spirit, but it does not alter the fact that you have done some wrong. Until you have put it right in the eyes of the Great White Spirit, the sin will remain. That is the Law, my son. You cannot alter laws, not even by quoting words from books, which you say the Nazarene said.

　"I tried to explain to you before. Not all those words were said by him, but many of them were added afterwards. When you say “The Nazarene said you mean you think the Nazarene said those things. What I want you to try and understand is that the same spirit, the same inspiration, the same force of the Great White Spirit which made the Nazar-ene the great master that he is, is waiting for you, if you open your heart to receive it from the Great White Spirit.

　"You are a part of the Great White Spirit. All His love, all His power, all His wisdoın, knowledge and truth are there waiting for you. You must not go back into the past for the Great White Spirit. He is here now; just as much the Great White Spirit today as He was in the time of the Nazarene, and the same powers He had then, He has now.

　"There are very few instruments through whom He can give His teaching and His power. Why should your Chris-tianity be dependent upon one human being of two thousand years ago? Why cannot all you men of God receive the same inspiration that he did? Why must you go back to what he said?"

　"I talk of the work of Christ in me,” was the parson's reply. "I believe it is possible to have inspiration."

　"Why do you limit the Great White Spirit to the Nazarene and to one book?" inquired the spirit. "Do you think that the whole of the Great White Spirit was expressed in one person or one book? I am not a Christian. I lived many years before the Nazarene came into your world. Did not the Great White Spirit make any allowance for my spirit to enter into His peace?

　"Do think all the Great White Spirit can be put into a few pages in one book? Do you think that when that book was finished, He had no more inspiration for His children? Do you think you have come to the end of His power when you have turned the last page of your Bible?"

　"I hope not,” said the minister. "I sometimes feel that I am inspired."

　"One day you shall go unto the Father also,” declared the spirit, "into one of those many, many mansions that you are preparing for yourself in your world today. I want you, who are a man of God, to understand that you cannot limit God, for He is everywhere. The lowest criminal in the lowest haunt of vice is linked with the Great White Spirit as much as the highest saint who ever lived in your world. The Great White Spirit is in each one of you. If you try to express that spirit, and if you will make your heart open, the Great White Spirit will pour through you the power

and the revelation that will bring light and comfort to all those who are in your corner of the vineyard."

　"How do you explain the fact that the only calendar that has survived to any extent is the Christian calendarz? was the next question.

　Silver Birch replied: "Who told you that? Have you not heard of the calendar of the Jewish people? In many other places there are still calendars in existence that date back from the beginning of their own religion. I do not try to belittle the work of the Nazarene. I know the work he does, and I know the Nazarene does not want to be worshipped as the Great White Spirit. The whole value of his life is as an example to be followed. Until the worshipping of the Nazarene stops, there will be little inspiration in your Chris-tianity."

　The minister then said: "We cannot find out when it was decided to make the date of Jesus's birth the beginning of the calendar. Can you tell me?"

　"I must answer in my own way," said the spirit. "A few days ago, a member of this circle went to the North. There he stayed with many of the children of the Great White Spirit. They are not people in high places. They are men who, if they have physical work, work very, very hard. When they have finished, often after digging deep into the bowels of the earth, they receive as a recompense a few physical pennies. They live in what you call houses, which are a disgrace to your Christian civilization.

　"In the same town there is what you call a house of God. This house of God is so tall that the houses near by, when God's sun shines, are in the shadow. They have more darkness in their lives than if the cathedral was not there. Do you think that is right?"

　'.I used to live in Durham,” said the parson.

　"I know," was the answer. "That is why I told you."

　"I am very sorry that they have to live in those houses,” the cleric declared.

　"Do you think the Nazarene would be pleased that they should?" said Silver Birch. "Do you think he would ask questions about the calendar as long as there were houses like that, and men who have to work like that, men who only have a few physical pennies, while all the time there are others to whom thousands of physical pennies do not matter?

　"Do you think that he would ask for money for cathedrals and ask about calendars and talk about good books when people lived like that? What do you think of a Christianity that goes on using his name and still allows these things to operate in this country that is called Christian?

　"You ask questions about texts. Religion has much more important and greater work to do. Do you not see that the Great White Spirit wants all His children to receive His bounty? In some parts of your world they are throwing away the necessities that other people starve for. Can you talk of Christianity while Christians do these things?

　"I have a much closer touch with the Nazarene than you imagine. I have seen his tears as he watches, because so many of his people and his ministers close their eyes to all the dis-grace which goes on in the shadow of their own churches. How can you be content to build churches which are sup-posed to be the houses of God, fill them with jewels and stained-glass windows, and boast of the building when all the time, in their shadows, there dwell children of the Great White Spirit who have not even necessities of life?

　"Many of them have not even a proper place on which to put their poor tired bodies when they have worked all day and sometimes into the night for a few physical pennies that are not enough for their bread. I do not speak with any bitterness to you. I am only filled with a big love for you, and would do anything to serve you. But I am in the spirit world and have few opportunities of talking to men like you, who can go out into your world and stir up things so that you can put right so much that is wrong.

　"I want you to understand there are more important things than texts in the Bible. Not every one that saith, 'Lord, Lord ... but he that doeth the will of my father.' He taught you that many years ago. Why cannot you make all people see that this is the only thing that matters? It is what you do that counts.

　'.As long as you countenance all the wars, the iniquity, the starvation, poverty, and unemployment, you are all failing in your Christianity, and you are not following the example of the Nazarene. You have come away from a big conference, where you have joined, in the last twelve months, three sections of your church. Unless when they are united they strive in unity to alter those blots on the Law of the Great White Spirit, your unity is nothing. I speak very frankly to you. I do not want any misunderstanding."

　"Some years ago, we threw open our schools and collected money in the churches to provide things for the unemployed," said the minister. "We cannot do everything, but, according to the number of people who go to church, don't you think we try very hard?”

　"I know your heart is good," the spirit commented, "otherwise I would not come back to talk to you again. I see in you an instrument which can be of service. The people who go to your churches are very few, but did not the Nazarene teach you to go out into the highways and byways? You must not wait for people to come to you. You must go to them.

　"You must make your church a centre of light, and feed not only the souls, but the starving physical bodies. Give them not only words of wisdom, but bread and the necessities of life. You must feed their souls and their bodies. You can help not only the spirit, but the body through which the spirit must function. Unless all the churches do this, the physical bodies will die because they do not get that which sustains them.”

　The guide then gave the parson a benediction: “I pray to the Great White Spirit that, wherever you are, whatever you do, His power and His love may sustain you; that your heart, always filled with a desire to serve, shall be open to the inspiration of the Great White Spirit. May He infuse into you a greater capacity for service, that you may build around you a centre of light, of peace, of happiness, so that all those who come to that centre may understand that it is a place where the Great White Spirit reigns.

　"May He bless you and sustain you and keep you always in His path. May you learn to understand more clearly His purpose, His power, and His plan. God bless you, my son, and go forward."